Curse

Silver_Fang · Aug 02, 2006, 12:24 PM // 12:24

the copied skill is for the peeps that dont have prophecies.

samcobra · Aug 02, 2006, 05:38 PM // 17:38

I really wish that Arenanet would give some sort of official comment about this. It is killing me! I already pm-ed Gaile Gray about it and she said that she would be unable to answer outside of a public forum ( like ingame or on a fansite).
So, I say.. get going Gaile! Tell us the answer.

Furthermore, the fact still remains that most of the people who bought factions also owned Prophecies. Although ANet markets each game as a stand-alone in its own right, the consumers consider them to be more like expansions. This being said, putting no support in for factions classes, which many have worked hard on over the past few months, will lose them several customers. If this trend continues, many of the GW players will probably be dissuaded from playing and the remaining players would all have only PVE core professions. So... whats the point of coming up with new professions if nobody keeps using them?

Jetdoc · Aug 02, 2006, 07:20 PM // 19:20

I agree that this is a bummer, but at the same time, you have to ask yourself...

"Are you going to create a Dervish or a Paragon when you buy Nightfall?"

I would assume that 95% of us will say "yes", which means that creating an Assassin or Ritualist when we bought Factions wasn't foolish. They are different classes, and part of the fun in playing the expansion is playing in those classes. If you don't have any further use for them, delete them after you're done playing Factions to free up two slots for Nightfall...it's as simple as that.

I personally love my ritualist, with all of these flaws. She does something rather unique in Guild Wars that won't be replaced by either of the new classes in Nightfall, so I really won't mind if her skillset stays the same. That and I'm happy with my armor as well...

...but I can definitely tell you that, with this knowledge, I am very likely NOT going to create an Assassin, given the introduction of another melee class in the Dervish and the fact that not many assassin skills, in their current form, appeal to me.

Horseman Of War · Aug 02, 2006, 07:24 PM // 19:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hella Good

Most likely skill distribution is the Factions format:
2 new profs 75 skills ea, 15 of which elites
6 core prof 25 new skills ea, 10 of which elites
Total: 300 skills, 90 of which elites
5 duplicate skills for each core prof likely, none of which elite

yes. thats about it.

Some people are upset about this, and they shouldnt be. Anet has said they are working on a large content addition (which doesnt mean new skills most likely...) so at least Factions-Only players will have that to look forward to.

Keep in mind that many people are going to get GW3 who do NOT have GW2... and having new skills for a class you cannot use is pointless.

Hella Good · Aug 02, 2006, 07:47 PM // 19:47

I dont think I am upset at all about this. I have a Rit who I love playing but I feel the profession is pretty much complete. I rly don't see what more they can add to it. Surely, if I try hard, I can "come up" with new skill ideas but I rly like my Rit as is. And I am actually gonna buy him Fissure soon. It doesn't bother me he won't have any new skills in Nightfall. I don't even know if I'll have the nrg to get him through the game! I barely got my Necro and Monk through Factions, short as it is. I still haven't done my Mesmer.

So if I am to make a Dervish and then roll my Necro and Monk, I doubt I'll have the desire for more. By chapter 4-5 I think only my core characters will ever get rolled through the game. I doubt I'll invest the nrg to roll every single chapter specific profession I make through. Not that I won't enjoy playing them.

So, it's all good. If they toss in some new content for Faction profs- that's gonna be nice. But I'm not gonna bite my nails over it.

GloryFox · Aug 02, 2006, 11:16 PM // 23:16

THE FOLLOWING ARE FACTS

First ANET has not said NO to new skills for the Assassin and Ritualist with Nightfall.

Second ANET has not said how many skills will be released with the Nightfall release, currently its all speculation.

Third many people here are posting "ANET SAID" without saying where ANET said it. Without evidince its all speculation.

ALL THAT ASIDE I AM CURIOUS ABOUT THE FOLLOWING

If ANET does not add skills for the Assassin and Ritualist with Nightfall release; will you bother making flavor classes for long-term usage in future chapters?

Will you delete your SIN or RIT?

In the case of Nightfall will you make a Paragon or Dervish knowing that these classes will no longer be supported with skills in later chapters?

Will you go through Nightfall with your SIN and RIT if you knew there were no items, armor, skills, or whatever else for these classes?

Will you call people n00b’s if you see a SIN or RIT, Paragon or Dervish or other flavor classes; if you see one knowing that those classes will be unsupported for future chapters?

Will you let them into your PvE groups knowing the Flavor of the chapter's are probably outdated old news trash anyways?

All of the above questions are assuming ANET will not add skills for these flavor classes in future chapters. EVEN THOUGH ANET NEVER SIAD THAT!

NOTE: Flavor classes = classes not used in Prophecies

GloryFox · Aug 02, 2006, 11:41 PM // 23:41

In response to my own questions…

Quote:

If ANET does not add skills for the Assassin and Ritualist with Nightfall release; will you bother making flavor classes for long-term usage in future chapters?

Probably not … I like the Paragon but why bother expanding on something that will never be expanded upon. Characters are money sinks and all of my characters are investments to me.

Quote:

Will you delete your SIN or RIT?

No I put to much investment and money into them to delete. This includes 15k armor for each. Plus they have all skills and ELITES for their profession.

Quote:

In the case of Nightfall will you make a Paragon or Dervish knowing that these classes will no longer be supported with skills in later chapters?

No I will not! No matter how good the class is I now know this class will never get better than what it is.

Quote:

Will you go through Nightfall with your SIN and RIT if you knew there were no items, armor, skills, or whatever else for these classes?

Yes, I will be the diamond in the rough. I already feel that way with my Assassin but I’m a good Assassin player so feel the diamond in the rough mentality already. Plus I can point at all the Dervish and say… “ha ha its your turn now”.

Quote:

Will you call people n00b’s if you see a SIN or RIT, Paragon or Dervish or other flavor classes; if you see one knowing that those classes will be unsupported for future chapters?

Absolutely not! I’m above that kind of behavior. However I have already seen that attitude playing factions already with anyone playing a Ritualist or an Assassin. There is a lot of class prejudice out there I won’t add too it.

Quote:

Will you let them into your PvE groups knowing the Flavor of the chapter's are probably outdated old news trash anyways?

YES! I will welcome the diamond in the rough and respect any player who will play or invest in a flavor class. I will just no longer make one myself.

samcobra · Aug 03, 2006, 12:22 AM // 00:22

How many others will follow in that mentality?

floppinghog · Aug 03, 2006, 10:34 PM // 22:34

I'll have to see how i feel after nightfall has come out and set and all, though regardless, i will not be deleting my assassin or ritualist.

Vilaptca · Aug 03, 2006, 11:10 PM // 23:10

If they still plan on releasing expansion packs that don't contain new professions, then this is what I see them doing; these expansions will be more like an expansion than a stand-alone, they will be almost strictly an add on, granting you a new storyline to play through, new areas for both PvE and PvP, new items, skills and armor for ALL classes.

I'm hoping that after Nightfall, they release an expansion like this. One that adds something to the game for everyone, whether you only have Prophecies, or you only have Factions. It will have more for Assassins, Ritualists, Dervishes and Paragons, that they won't get in future expansions because they aren't core classes. This would also be a great marketing way to get a Factions only player to see that maybe the Dervishes aren't so bad, and convince them to get a copy of Nightfall.

I'll keep making these special classes, but I'm just not very gung-ho about them right now, I'm having a hard time justifying the crap you go through as an Assassin to keep him past level 15. Now if I find out that he'll be supported in future expansions, as one would hope the professionless expansions would, then I may actually play through Factions on my Assassin.

fleshvirus · Aug 04, 2006, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Since prophecis proffessions were able to get Faction stuff, then why not Faction getting Nightfall stuff. That completely makes sense

*Africanish Ritualist dress, HAWT !!!*

mooshee · Aug 04, 2006, 03:25 AM // 03:25

If Anet doesnt give the sin new skills and armors in the new expansion, i will hate them forevermore. I mean there is absolutely no reason for them not to. All it would do is make people playing the game happier, such as myself, who loves the assasin class. Right now the assasin is expiriencing hate where ever they go, and the only way to solve this is to add more skills and more possibilities for this underused profession.

Plz Anet, keep sins and rits in this game....

ogami_ito · Aug 04, 2006, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Anet should make expansions that support previous characters, but do not include them. That means there should be a few new elites for sins and rits, and some armor, but not allow people to make sins unless they own factions. That makes sense from a business, fairness, and a lore view. Business because it shows the community that support will be provided, so people are more likely to buy new chapters. Fairness because it means people who bought factions still have something unique that nightfall owners don't have. Lore because it makes sense to have sins and ritualists in a north african / mediteranian chapter.

Ideally, every chapter expands on the value of the whole. Only if elements (i.e. toons) are supported would this really happen though.

some guy · Aug 04, 2006, 04:16 AM // 04:16

well they do have assassin and ritualist FoW armor, so they might add some new armor in nightfall

Relambrien · Aug 04, 2006, 04:47 AM // 04:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooshee

If Anet doesnt give the sin new skills and armors in the new expansion, i will hate them forevermore. I mean there is absolutely no reason for them not to. All it would do is make people playing the game happier, such as myself, who loves the assasin class. Right now the assasin is expiriencing hate where ever they go, and the only way to solve this is to add more skills and more possibilities for this underused profession.

Plz Anet, keep sins and rits in this game....

The response to this is simple, though it has been stated many times...

Think about what would happen if this were to happen with every chapter.

With Factions, the six core professions needed new skills and stuff, while the Sin and Rit were completely new. This would mean in Nightfall, eight professions would need new stuff, and in chapter four, ten would need new stuff. This would continue until eventually sixteen, twenty professions would need new stuff. It just isn't possible for Anet to come up with that much content in the time period between the release of each game. Therefore, having each non-core profession get only what they get when the game is released is the best strategy for them. This would also mean, then, that the 2 professions introduced in Chapter X would only be available to play in Chapter X PvE-wise. Why would you make sin and rit characters selectable in Nightfall when the description for Shing Jea Monastery says that the Sin and Rit are native to Cantha?

Besides that, the Sin and Rit are about as complete as I feel they will get. They have their place in PvP, and even though they're looked down upon in PvE, those who know how to play them will often find a group who will take them. No new skills would really improve upon the class. The reason the sin is hated in PvE isn't because of the skills, it's because of how people play the class. Many don't play the sin as it was meant to be played: a melee attacker who goes in after the tank has aggroed and gets out after taking out an enemy.

Now, on another note, I feel inclined to answer GloryFox's questions as I would answer them.

1. If ANET does not add skills for the Assassin and Ritualist with Nightfall release; will you bother making flavor classes for long-term usage in future chapters?
A. I would make them, of course, as PvE is the easiest way to unlock skills. I wouldn't bother with them after unlocking their skills in PvE because I know they won't get anything else. Their purpose is complete. I'm a hard-core PvPer so I only do PvE to get the skills and other unlocks I need.

2. Will you delete your SIN or RIT?
A. Most likely no. I get two character slots for the new professions each time so I don't need to delete them. They're good for getting birthday gifts if nothing else.

3. In the case of Nightfall will you make a Paragon or Dervish knowing that these classes will no longer be supported with skills in later chapters?
A. Of course, even if their skills won't be expanded upon later at least I know I can get them now. They'll still be useful in PvP, as long as they can be worked into builds with what they have. The Sin and Rit work in PvP, so I hope the Para and Derv will be the same.

4. Will you go through Nightfall with your SIN and RIT if you knew there were no items, armor, skills, or whatever else for these classes?
A. I didn't even bother going through Factions with my Tyrian characters. I do the story once per profession to get skills but that's it. So no.

5. Will you call people n00b’s if you see a SIN or RIT, Paragon or Dervish or other flavor classes; if you see one knowing that those classes will be unsupported for future chapters?
A. Of course not. Just because the core classes get more skills doesn't necessarily mean they get skills that will own the non-core classes. Even if their skill choice is limited, their skills will WORK. That's the important thing. Just because they have less of choice doesn't mean they're less effective, at least, not enough to make them ineffective.

6. Will you let them into your PvE groups knowing the Flavor of the chapter's are probably outdated old news trash anyways?
A. Of course. As long as they can play their class the way it's meant to be played (wow I just used NVidia's slogan) I don't see any reason not to. They'll be beneficial to the team as long as they can play their class effectively.

One last thing before I leave you with this already-long post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by some guy

well they do have assassin and ritualist FoW armor, so they might add some new armor in nightfall

If I understand what you're trying so say, you believe that FoW is Proph-only and the Sin/Rit got armor there, so they might get armor in Nightfall. This is untrue because FoW and UW are core, not proph-only. Zin Ku Corridor is the Canthan version of Temple of the Ages, and you can access the areas from there.

If I misunderstood you, however, feel free to tell me what you really meant.

Tartagan · Aug 04, 2006, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Hmm, personnaly I really hope Anet will give more skills to Rit and Sins even if I don t play them.

But anyway isn t the Parangon premade P/Rt ?? It s maybe a clue ...

pve-er · Aug 04, 2006, 10:59 AM // 10:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tartagan

Hmm, personnaly I really hope Anet will give more skills to Rit and Sins even if I don t play them.

But anyway isn t the Parangon premade P/Rt ?? It s maybe a clue ...

Probably PvP only.

like other said, there are not much need of new skill for Asassin, but the current skill really need a buff to keep on with the game just like Ele. (I dont have Rt, Can't commant on that)

SpeedyKQ · Aug 04, 2006, 01:43 PM // 13:43

I think people are getting way too worked up over this. I'm absolutely planning on taking my rit through Nightfall, because I enjoy playing my rit. OK, I won't be able to tweak my skillbar. Whoopdee-doo. I already like my skillbar. I already like my 15K armor too - I don't care to buy another set.

I don't know, maybe if my rit were my only character I'd feel a little more bummed. I had already read Gaile's explanation that sins and rits would be Factions-only when I made the character, so I knew what I was getting into.

And this is certainly not going to stop me from trying the Dervish or Paragon. I'm supposed to deny myself the chance to try these out just because I won't get to tweak my skillbar in six months?

Bio-Flame · Aug 04, 2006, 02:01 PM // 14:01

BTW, in Magic the Gathering (and most games really) the "older" powers/cards/skills/etc... are always more powerful than the newer ones.

Why? Because when you're designing a brand new game you don't know what's "broken" and what isn't yet. So usually things are a lot more powerful in the begining. As the game evolves and new stuff is added the Devs already have a good grasp on their own game and mechanics and thus things are rarely as "broken" as before.

There are exceptions of course since nobody is perfect and sometimes a new stuff is more powerfull than before. But these are just that:exceptions not the rule.

If you don't believe just compare the sheer difference in adjustments in Prophecies Skills and Factions.....

Hella Good · Aug 04, 2006, 02:13 PM // 14:13

There was an interview in which one of the devs specifically talked about non-core prof being chapter specific and NOT getting any extra stuff in conseq. chapters. Whoever wants to blindly believe ANet will be wasting time doing so needs to face the reality of this- they can't keep introducing new stuff for all the additional profs because the amount of work involved will be enormous. Balancing the game with just the 6 cores and the new profs is going to only become increasingly challenging. What if all of a sudden they decided to add new stuff for the extra profs? It's not only a matter of coming up with a few new skills, it's a matter of balancing those against the hundreds of other skills! And then can you imagine the design team working on creating new armors, new weapons, new toys for 20 profs when chapter 8 rolls out??? And this is NOT far ahead, we're already at 3 end of this year. Seriously, wake up and smell the coffee! They cannot physically do it. Well, they can but the amount of work will greatly exceed the 1 year of development allowed for each chapter. These things are NOT speculations. They were explained numerous times in numerous ways by numerous ANet reps. New profs ARE chapter specific.

Surely, some form of new content for the new profs is likely. But do not expect the same treatment that the cores get. It just won't happen!